Yet another Hacker News

189 points petecooper 10 hours ago 69 comments

I posted here about the then-upcoming PHP RCEs related to CVE-2026-109618 & CVE-2026-109619. I appreciate this has had considerable knock-on effects with the schedule for co-ordinated disclosure, and created additional workload.

I am truly sorry. I take full responsibility for my actions.

It was not remotely my intention to cause any of the subsequent side effects.

At the time of posting, I didn't know about any embargo. My contact had told me there was no embargo, and her contact had told her the same thing.

As someone who follows the 4-weekly PHP release cycle and compiles it from source, my intention was to alert others in a similar position to be aware of the importance/urgency of the updates.

That clearly backfired in a pretty wild fashion. I have learned my lesson.

cwillu 9 hours ago | parent

Don't be silly, you can't possibly be responsible for breaking an embargo you weren't subject to or informed about.

petecooper 9 hours ago | parent

That's fair. For clarity: I take responsibility for posting on HN, without knowing the facts.

Onavo 8 hours ago | parent

Not sure what you are apologizing for. It's a severely overblown bug that ended up on the front page of New York Times and the Japan Prime Minister had to get involved too. The bug itself is non trivial to exploit from just public requests to a web server so I am not sure what the hysteria is about. It's no different from the other hundred or so CVEs I see being posted or dropped everyday.

It will be headlines on Hacker News regardless due to sheer sensationalism, I think most DevSecOps people would rather find out the news here first than via their boss calling them after reading the morning news.

Klonoar 7 hours ago | parent

The Japanese PM did not “have” to get involved.

Onavo 5 hours ago | parent

Well, consider that their old IT minister has never used a computer in his life, it's probably a good thing she's the one issuing the call to update.

Fnoord 1 hour ago | parent

You've used a computer the moment you aren't even born yet.

dylan604 31 minutes ago | parent

Okay, now I'm curious about what sci-fi trope you've gone too far down a rabbit hole in.

fouc 17 minutes ago | parent

must be proof we're in a simulation!

ang_cire 5 minutes ago | parent

"The sonogram or EKG machine is a computer, so the baby used a computer, checkmate!"

tptacek 22 minutes ago | parent

What does "non trivial to exploit from just public requests" mean? It's known to be exploitable on more than one stock PHP application. This really is a 5-alarm fire.

CER10TY 9 minutes ago | parent

I think people are just latching onto the post that hit the front page earlier today about it being non-trivial to exploit, combined with the fact that there seem to be about a billion PoC out there, most of which don't work.

bell-cot 8 hours ago | parent

Responsibility may include vetting your sources - is this person competent and dutiful, to actually know there's no embargo? - and researching the situation, and thinking several moves ahead, and other stuff.

Reality is that everyone has to make decisions in finite time, using the resources they actually have.

And I'd put a whole lot more responsibility further up that chain of contacts. And question how many other people they might have blabbered to.

petecooper 8 hours ago | parent

>And question how many other people they might have blabbered to.

100%. I'm concerned about the two-way street this might also have opened me up to with information I shared privately with this individual. Nothing significant or incriminating, but the professional relationship is concluded.

possmap 9 hours ago | parent

It happens. Information cascades are messy, especially with multi-layered contacts

Thanks for owning it ,the best thing now is ensuring the patch details are clear once the official release drops. Moving forward is what matters

reboot81 6 hours ago | parent

You’re setting a great example of how to be open and take responsibility, even when you’re not actually at fault. I really respect how you’ve handled this. You’ve also given the community a valuable reminder that some security disclosures may be under embargo, and that it’s worth having in mind before sharing.

rancar2 7 hours ago | parent

That’s kind of you, Pete, but it was leaked and being exploited well prior to your previous posting here: https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/security/amazon-threat-intellig...

ChrisArchitect 6 hours ago | parent

Related (where you already posted a bit of this):

Today's PHP security release, and how we're strengthening security

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=50182987

voakbasda 6 hours ago | parent

Really hope you are not in the US. This kind of admission would be used against you in a civil trial, and lawyers love to sue for just about any reason under the sun. Someone could drag you to court and you might be able to defend yourself, but at an extremely painful cost both financially and emotionally. While I think that would be utter bullshit, that does seem to be the way this country operates now.

petecooper 6 hours ago | parent

I am not in the US.

throw_m239339 1 hour ago | parent

The parent is getting downvoted but he is absolutely right. Do not ever do what you just did. It makes you an easy target for a frivolous lawsuit in the US or in other countries because of the potential liabilities in your message, they are real. Even if you didn't do anything wrong, you are painting a target on your back, for no reason. I would ask HN to delete that thread directly.

You cannot foresee the financial/civil consequences of that RCE and some people might be looking for scapegoats in the future.

ceejayoz 1 hour ago | parent

There's at least some evidence in the other direction.

https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2017/10/in-patient-in...

> New research shows that discussing hospital errors with patients leads to better patient safety without spurring a barrage of malpractice claims.

throw_m239339 1 hour ago | parent

It has nothing to do with anything I said.

ceejayoz 37 minutes ago | parent

Sure it does. Saying sorry sometimes reduces liability risk, which is quite counterintuitive at first.

throw_m239339 32 minutes ago | parent

> Sure it does. Saying sorry sometimes reduces liability risk, which is quite counterintuitive at first.

No it doesn't have anything to do with what I said. The OP has no contractual or legal obligations toward any community, unlike a doctor and their patients in case of medical error.

edit:

> A doctor has no contractual obligation to apologize, either.

> But it can help prevent things from going to lawsuits, versus the "fuck you I admit nothing" approach that sometimes just pisses people off.

OP isn't a doctor as far as you know, and isn't apologizing to a specific person. OP can't be bound to an embargo he didn't know about and wasn't involved in any decisions.

You're completely off topic and you just want the last word.

Your ramblings have nothing to do with anything I have said.

ceejayoz 25 minutes ago | parent

A doctor has no contractual obligation to apologize, either.

But it can help prevent things from going to lawsuits, versus the "fuck you I admit nothing" approach that sometimes just pisses people off.

cosmotic 46 minutes ago | parent

Anyone can sue anyone else for any reason. We should encourage honesty and transparency, not discourage it.

SoftTalker 40 minutes ago | parent

While possibly true in theory, in practice it's not. Courts and judges do not take kindly to frivolous or unsubstantiated claims, and any halfway good attorney would advise you to not waste your money and your time on a claim you are unlikely to win or be able to collect on.

People and companies do get sued with the full intention of a settlement and it never going to trial. But that only happens when the defendant has deep pockets or good insurance.

throw_m239339 36 minutes ago | parent

This isn't a matter of transparency, was the OP legally bound not to disclose the RCE? That whole "embargo" was pure courtesy between the people involved. The OP committed no fault at first place and the exploit was already in the wild anyway. Whoever really wanted to exploit it before the patch could without using the OP as a source.

> Anyone can sue anyone else for any reason.

And it's easier to have cause to sue when someone publish an "admission of guilt", which makes a lawsuit harder to dismiss thus costlier.

ivanjermakov 6 hours ago | parent

The first rule of the fight club only applies if you know about the fight club.

hanspagel 1 hour ago | parent

What is the fight club?

bunderbunder 1 hour ago | parent

the coordinated disclosure

gpvos 1 hour ago | parent

It's a quote from a 1999 film: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fight_Club

qingcharles 25 minutes ago | parent

We don't talk about The Fight Club.

deadnomore 38 minutes ago | parent

what about the second rule of fight club?

wewewedxfgdf 2 hours ago | parent

mindcrime 2 hours ago | parent

The modern version:

You have sinned.

Your penance:

Three Hail Claude's, one Our GPT and an act of loop engineering.

Two minutes of silent prompting.

solyin 1 hour ago | parent

and 1 hour, writing code, no AI.

wewewedxfgdf 49 minutes ago | parent

That's a bit harsh.

robrain 47 minutes ago | parent

What joy. Not much of a punishment.

qubex 2 hours ago | parent

What does “take full responsibility” mean in the present context? Are you forfeiting all your assets and pledging the next twenty generations of your descendants into peonage?

(For clarity, I’m being facetious, but it’s a really meaningless and empty phrase to commit to the written record.)

petecooper 1 hour ago | parent

>What does “take full responsibility” mean in the present context?

I posted something that -- in hindsight -- I shouldn't have, and it had repercussions for a lot of people. An action that I took had considerable knock-in effects around the world.

Some outlets are reporting that my action of posting something that I believed to be in good faith was an indicator or catalyst for the embargo to be tossed out and a previously-agreed schedule to change in short order.

That's not a normal Wednesday for me. Not even vaguely. I've not slept well since, and my taking ownership with an apology is this new course of action. Hopefully I'll sleep tonight.

re: assets and peonage – I am but a broke & wizened nerd with no known descendants. If you're ever in Cornwall, UK: look me up, I'll gladly buy you a sleep-friendly beverage. And I’m not being facetious.

zer00eyz 58 minutes ago | parent

Shit happens.

Years ago I lost $250K at work, well gave away, so real money out the door. I figured out why we were bleeding, that the mistake was mine (2008 vs 2009 in a function) and then changed the pattern to use explicit names rather than numbered events.

I figured at the end of the day I was fired. My boss laughed at me and told me good job for owning my mistake, fixing it, and then making sure it could not happen again.

Honestly don't just apologize - tell the whole story, in full. Tell us what you should have done differently at each step. Tell us where the process failed you and us. Those sorts of narratives and suggestions are how processes get improved. There is a humble and informative post mortem that you can write up and publish (beyond HN) for everyone's edification. But that should honestly be a Monday thing, when you have a clear head and some more perspective on the whole situation.

Honestly though, dont beat yourself up over this.

ktm5j 44 minutes ago | parent

Yep, everyone makes mistakes. It's the learning-from-it part that's really important.

john_strinlai 32 minutes ago | parent

>I figured at the end of the day I was fired. My boss laughed at me and told me good job for owning my mistake, fixing it, and then making sure it could not happen again.

i forget the origin of the story, but i loosely remember a story about a boss and employee in a similar situation. the important bit was the bosses line ($ adjusted to match your story):

"why would i fire you when i just spent $250k training you"

arto 24 minutes ago | parent

You may be thinking of Dale Carnegie's classic story:

> Any fool can criticize, condemn, and complain—and most fools do.

> But it takes character and self-control to understand and forgive.

> “A great man shows his greatness,” said Carlyle, “by the way he treats little men.”

> Bob Hoover, a famous test pilot and frequent performer at air shows, was returning to his home in Los Angeles from a show in San Diego. As described in the magazine Flight Operations, at three hundred feet in the air, both engines suddenly stopped. By deft maneuvering he managed to land the plane. It was badly damaged, but fortunately neither he nor his two passengers were hurt.

> Hoover’s first act after the emergency landing was to inspect the airplane’s fuel. Just as he suspected, the World War II propeller plane he had been flying had been loaded with jet fuel rather than gasoline.

> Upon returning to the airport, Hoover asked to see the mechanic who had serviced his airplane. The young man was sick with the agony of his mistake. Tears streamed down his face as Hoover approached. He had just caused the loss of a very expensive plane and could have caused the loss of three lives, as well.

> You can imagine Hoover’s anger. One could anticipate the tongue-lashing that this proud and precise pilot was about to unleash for that carelessness. But Hoover didn’t scold the mechanic; he didn’t even criticize him. Instead, he put his big arm around the man’s shoulder and said, “To show you I’m sure that you’ll never do this again, I want you to service my F51 tomorrow.”

john_strinlai 19 minutes ago | parent

i have a feeling it was an IBM story/legend, but my memory isn't what it used to be.

however, it's much the same in spirit as the one you posted, thanks!

herodoturtle 52 minutes ago | parent

> What does “take full responsibility” mean in the present context?

Aside from Pete's reply (see adjacent comment), I'd add that him taking full responsibility is also his way of saying his post was nobody else's fault but his.

In other words it's less about forfeiting assets and descendant peonage, and more about saying "the buck stops with me".

At least that's my read of his sentiment. Pete can expand if need be.

dylan604 33 minutes ago | parent

I know nothing of who Pete is or his associations, so any accuracy on the following speculation is purely coincidental.

"Take full responsibility" is also something someone set up as a scapegoat might say. By claiming nobody else influenced, coerced, or otherwise convinced them to make that statement, every/any one else involved can then wash their hands of the situation.

I'm merely playing devil's advocate here, and it's just a sign of the times that a person making an honest admission can be interpreted in such a manner.

petecooper 5 minutes ago | parent

[Devil's advocate noted.]

I'm not a scapegoat. Aside from a few brusque messages and a few people from my past finding me on LinkedIn, I've heard nothing from anyone.

I've seen my HN username mentioned on various outlets, and That Post© has been linked from a Wikipedia article, so I can chalk this up to experience. My fear (?) is that HN would get a reputational clobbering from me 'leaking', but given the other moving parts in this whole event I probably shouldn't be too concerned.

It's been a while since I've been involved in an international event, I'm a bit rusty on it!

petecooper 11 minutes ago | parent

>At least that's my read of his sentiment. Pete can expand if need be.

That's about it. Mea culpa.

Papazsazsa 48 minutes ago | parent

Taking responsibility for a mistake is neither meaningless nor empty, but honorable. The very essence of humanity.

axus 37 minutes ago | parent

It does NOT mean "He agrees to settle any financial claims against himself or his employer, for damages caused by negligence".

Could have said "I blame only myself for this mistake, nothing else needs to change".

This will keep happening until the system where this can happen runs out of willing scapegoats.

drcongo 1 hour ago | parent

You're a good person with good intentions. Hope you get some rest sir.

NamlchakKhandro 54 minutes ago | parent

It's ok. It's just php.

dylan604 30 minutes ago | parent

It's okay. It's just 70% of websites.

john_strinlai 53 minutes ago | parent

if you received the information about the RCEs without the information about the embargo, then you did not break the embargo. someone else up the chain did.

this whole saga will be analyzed and we'll all come out better for it at the end.

kinduff 50 minutes ago | parent

I hope this is bait because that's not how it works.

john_strinlai 46 minutes ago | parent

you cannot be subject to an embargo of which you had no knowledge and took no participation in.

the embargo was already broken when pete received the information.

cperciva 45 minutes ago | parent

This is exactly how it works. People who are part of the embargo are responsible for making sure that anyone they share information with -- which should usually be nobody! -- are aware of and abide by the embargo.

michaelbuckbee 42 minutes ago | parent

So if I read the post here and told someone, would I be breaking the embargo?

kinduff 32 minutes ago | parent

No, you didn't. I misread.

dylan604 39 minutes ago | parent

This is not a situation where "Ignorantia juris non excusat" applies.

kinduff 35 minutes ago | parent

Okay, my bad. I didn't know he was not participating in the embargo.

tonymet 37 minutes ago | parent

Can someone, with the benefit of hindsight, explain the embargo ? Why isn't there a clause "if the vuln leaks, embargo is broken" . I still don't understand the fuss.

Everyone knew about the vuln well before the patches going live. The embargo, at that point, made things worse.

In plain english, please.

nicce 10 minutes ago | parent

The idea is that nobody has chance to have prior knowledge to identify or research the bug until it is generally possible to apply the fix immediately. If someone leaks the patch beforehand, others can inspect the bug and start exploiting it in the wild, while others have no chance to apply the patch.

Whether someone just leaked the CVE numbers or just ”there is big bug in PHP” - that should not be enought to accelerate finding that bug. But other information that pins the bug for specific property or feature makes it easier to find and race against patching starts.

And at that point you don’t really know if someone really found it or not, since only few big organisations can collect that much data to detect succesful exploiting. And most ”PoC”:s in the wild were credible-looking but vibecoded mess that did nothing what sources claimed.

Until there is absolute evidence that exploitation happens in the wild, succesfully, you don’t leak the patch or bug details beforehand.

In this case, the area where the bug is in PHP, leaked partially, but apparently there was no enough evidence that it was exploited succesfully or if any of the PoCs in the wild actually worked properly. So patch or related detailed information was not released before the intial schedule.

deadnomore 34 minutes ago | parent

This is definitionally humble bragging.

iambateman 25 minutes ago | parent

Thanks Pete. I appreciate you taking the time to post here.

aksss 14 minutes ago | parent

So.. what has the effect of this all been? I understand that the early release of POC exploits increased the pressure for mitigations in advance of the patch release and caused a lot of work and stress. I have read the tweets from Cloudflare with statistics for malformed requests related to suspected exploit attempts.

I know breaches are often kept under wraps, and there's a long tail. But is there any evidence of impact at this point? Were any sites compromised that we know about? There was a lot of hullabaloo, with foreign and domestic LE agencies recommending sites be taken offline (holy shit!).

Was this like Y2K where, based on the coordinated action of many, a real issue was addressed in time? Or is it like Hale Bopp where everybody watched, and a few casualties in the preparation, but ultimately a nothingburger?

Flame on!

jakelsaunders94 11 minutes ago | parent

Hope you're doing alright mate. Seems like an honest attempt to do the right thing to me. Get some sleep.